Poster: Irenicus at 11/18/2005 5:06:59 PM PST
Subject: SpellDamage, Bugs, Hypochondria |
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Spell Damage, Bugs, Hypochondria: Mage Issues
I am writing this little essay to try and offer an alternative point of view on the flaws of the mage class. Currently mage screaming has reached a crescendo and the pathos of the situation is quite frankly depressing. I have been a mage for a long time and I have read a lot of posts from alot of forums. I have other high level alts, including shamans, warlocks, paladins druids and a warrior. I have perspective on what makes a class and what breaks a class and also how the other classes fare against the mage. My perspective is not complete by any means. Some of my alts are low enough not to infringe on the problem zones of the class, others are well into the endgame, but I can say with certainty that there is no reason for the mage community to be a riled as they are. There are legitimate issues floating around out there but they are for the most part buried in the mounds of whining that has infected the usually sedate forum. So I am going to try and outline all the problem with the mage class in one post that does not exagerate or whine. I am when possible going to present solutions, and if an issue is less than concrete I will label it as such. I will also bring up the more popular whines and do my best to explain why people shouldn't be whining.
There, my pompous introduction is Done. On to the real issues
PS. For those of you that have read my spell damage surgery post or Xantha's bandage(http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.aspx?FN=wow-mage&T=467773&P=1), forgive the repitition. I am trying to get the point across in a more eloquent and better formatted way.
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Table of contents
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I. Spell Damage
II. Bugs
III. Itemization
IV. Debunking
V. Conclusion
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I. SPELL DAMAGE
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Spell damage is the single issue that lies at the heart of the mage problem. It is in fact a caster issue as a whole but the mage is one of the more effected classes because of the extra penalties that our AoE spells receive, AoE being for us the crux of our class and a issue central to our balance. In simple terms this entire section boils down to this. For spell damage to be balanced it needs to be a percentage system increase system, with 600-700 spell damage constituting a 100% increase in damage . The reason for this necessity is that by basing damage off of cast time, the fundamental balance of spells has shifted in the endgame, overpowering some and leaving others to wither. For 1-60 a mage learns to use certain spells in certain situations, once he passes into the endgame the balance begins to shift and suddenly things are no longer the same. The spells original designs become less and less important and the spells themselves become more and more unimportant, only how well they serve to deliver the plus damage that the mage has. As one man eloquently put it At a certain point, all its about is finding the right missile to deliver the spell damage warhead .
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Subsection 1: How spell damage works now
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Spell damage works currently by taking the total amount of plus damage you have on your gear then applying it to each spell in your repertoire. The individual spells apply a penalty to the spell damage based on 3 conditions.
1. Does it Take 3.5 seconds or more to cast? If yes then the spell gets full bonus. If no then one divides the spells cast time by 3.5 and multiplies that by the spell damage. Instant casts are considered 1.5 second cast spells.
2. Does it have any special effects, like chill? If yes apply a 5% penalty to it. If no, no penalty.
3. Is it AoE? If yes divide the spell damage by 3.
There is one special Rule about spells with DoT's. The damage is divided evenly over the entire spell, so each individual tick gets only a percentage of the total damage. If the spell has an up front and a DoT then the total damage of the spell is added up and each part gets a proportionate share of the plus damage. Talent abilities aren't factored into the spell damage in any way. So if a spell gains an ability that would cause a penalty or lowers its cast time it calculates plus damage as if it were untalented.
Here are all the Mage spells and the Amount of Plus damage they get.
Fireball: 100%, the DoT is fixed at 72 damage and takes none of the plus damage
Frostbolt: 81.4%
Arcane Missiles: 100%
Scorch: 42.9%
Fireblast: 42.9%
Cone of Cold: 13.3%
Flame Strike: 28.6% (15.6% up front, 12.8% over the DoT, 3.2% per tick.)
Blizzard: 33.3% (4.2% per wave)
Pyroblast: 100% (75% up front, 25% in the DoT, 4.2% per tick)
Arcane Explosion: 14%
Blast Wave: 13.3%
Icebarrier: 0%
Mana Shield: 0%
One final note about spell damage before we move onto the issue. That is that anything that applies a percentage modifier to the spell, like firepower (10%) or arcane power (35%) or improved cone of Cold (35%) does so AFTER spell damage.[ post edited by Irenicus ]
If brute force doesn't work, you're not using enough
| | | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-mage&t=524887&p=#post524887 | | | Poster: Tseric at 11/18/2005 5:50:36 PM PST
Subject: Re: SpellDamage, Bugs, Hypochondria |
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Bump 'cause I'm interested. Will probably edit this later ;)
In other news, the sky is falling.
| | | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-mage&t=524887&p=#post525029 | Poster: Tseric at 11/18/2005 5:58:16 PM PST
Subject: Re: SpellDamage, Bugs, Hypochondria |
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Q u o t e:
I'm glad we're paying your salary for such posts as this.
Can I make 30 grand a year trolling in these forums?
Well, I take that back, you have been..well..nice. you havent helped mages at all, yet, though.
So...you're bagging on me because I'm reserving a spot for feedback?
You think that's trolling?
What?
In other news, the sky is falling.
| | | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-mage&t=524887&p=#post525053 | Poster: Tseric at 11/18/2005 5:50:36 PM PST
Subject: Re: SpellDamage, Bugs, Hypochondria *edited post* |
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Sorry for the delay in this response.
You do have some great notions and perceptions of spell damage and its operation, but there is something to get out of the way first. Early on, you make a particular assumption which isn't entirely untrue, but affects the approach of some of your thinking.
While spell damage may be constructed around a 3.5 second cast time, it should not be considered a "baseline" for measuring damage output. Fireball is receiving full benefit of spell damage, so other spells comparitively are going to likely appear as less in strength.
Regardless, your observations that some of these spells and spell types (instant-cast, AoE, etc.) are not benefitting as much as they should is fairly on the mark.
For something like Arcane Missiles, the designers want to do some reworking as to how the bonus coefficients are applied. In the case of this spell, they feel it doesn't hold up as well as others.
AoEs operate rather differently under the spell damage system as well and this is also something the devs wish to reconsider and tinker with.
However, in a broader sense, the system is felt to give fair bonuses to various types of spells. Such could be the case for Pyroblast, which was adjusted to receive more spell damage benefits than cited here(I believe the change was in 1.9). Pyroblast is working at more than 100%, in terms of bonus given through spell damage.
In summation, while the devs don't feel the necessity for a total revamp, adjustments are being considered and developed for individual spells to put them in line with the system.
Bugs:
While we definitely realize the inhibitive nature of some of these bugs, they are dealt with through a different process than game design. All we can really do is prioritize them and find solutions as able. What I will say is that long standing issues such as AM and Blink functionality are not forgotten issues. There is serious thought being put into resolutions regularly. Again, we probably won't be able to give specifics until we have something really nailed down.
Hypochondria:
An interesting topic and one that has concerned me for some time. Yet another astute observation in this thread. I feel there may be a great many factors which could contribute to the frustration level of some mages. Obviously, the aforementioned bugs, when encountered, can strip a player of a sense of power and control. There is a strong chance you die in a situation like that and there is nothing you can do about it.
I think it is also a big factor that performance from a mage is based heavily in skill. With escape spells like Blink and Frost Nova, a players survivability is based more in reaction time and choice than anything else. This can also be reflected in damage output. Being attentive and maintaining a "line" or course of action can make the difference between good damage and great damage.
An anecdote that sticks out clearly in my mind was a time when I was running Scarlet Strat on my warlock. We had two mages in the group, one of which was a GM I was in another (OMG secrit blizz chat!)channel with, the other a complete stranger we had picked up into the group. The stranger was rather haughty from the get-go. At the beginning of the dungeon, they were running in, telling the other mage to "watch and learn". It wasn't too far into things that the "watch and learn" mage was getting smoked on the meters, by a large margin. Granted, he was still in second place, but there was a clear distinction in damage output from the mage who was paying attention and lining up spells, and the one who might have been looking for attention.
Now, perhaps a certain spec was involved, perhaps spell choice. I think there were a number of factors. Point being, having a "powerful" class is not the final word in how much damage a class can dish out or what not. Playstyles can make a dramatic difference in what occurs.
Now, I'm sure we all agree that mages could use some attention with regards to class balance and such, but it is very necessary to distinguish issues and factors in design, game play and execution.
For example: Mage survivability in BGs arises as a topic fairly frequently. A complicated issue with a number of factors.
However, it gives me an uncertain feeling when I hear some mages saying "I tend to run in hit FN and then start spamming AE til everyone dies". In my own head, I have to reconcile the fact that they are putting themselves directly into harm's way, coupled with the likelyhood of low HP.
The greatest antedote to hypochondria is seperating things into parts we can distinguish clearly and address them from there. Not to let things overwhelm and lump all issues into a great ball of frustration. It is not enough to say "I get hit for a lot of damage, therefore I should have more armor". We have to look beyond surface appearances. We can help each other in that endeavor, much in the same way this post has accomplished.
Cheers.[ post edited by Tseric ]
In other news, the sky is falling.
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