[ post edited by Caydiem ]

---

Q u o t e:
by world events the community is speaking more about storyline sequences...not a fishing tournament or a carnival.

A world event where arthas just spawns in random areas and slays everything in his way. World Events where Thrall and the other leaders of major factions well lead raids against an opposing faction.

Real events that show the warcraft story and the war between the horde and alliance.

---

---

Q u o t e:
That argument makes no sense. Do you stand around in each zone and respawn every mob killed? No you add the amount that the NPC can move and the timer he can respawn on.

If the developers want this mob dead after, say ten kills, they can easily script that it. It has nothing to do with the number of servers it has to do with the developer's laziness.

---

• Developer Time vs. Player Time; the Repeatable Content Factor. Any sort of event like this takes time to create and execute. No company has infinite resources, and it's important that the talented staff work on projects that will make best use of their time. When working on a persistent world such as World of Warcraft, where no one actually finishes the game, repeatable content is a must. Players, by nature, devour content far faster than it can be implemented. Therefore, repeatable content is key. Dungeons are an example of this. Battlegrounds are another. They're features that are used by players over and over again.
  
  Now, world-changing events tend to be one-time happenings that may take a month to create but only two days to occur for players. The question comes into play... which is better? A one-time event with all the bells and whistles, or a new dungeon? Which would best utilize the developers' time? The answer, more often than not, turns out to be the one that pertains to repeatable content.
  
  
• Dynamic vs. Scripted; the Manpower Factor. The question then comes into play... all right, if you'd rather have the developers work on repeatable content, why not hire people specifically for world events? As someone who has done precisely that job for two other games in this genre, again, I'm fairly knowledgeable regarding the pros and cons.
  
  Let me define a term before I delve deeper: "dynamic event", in this case, is a term for a world event run and executed by actors in the world playing the NPCs or controlling the monsters in some fashion.
  
  Now, developers implementing world events are more akin to actual, coded game interactions -- true NPCs and scripted occurrences patched in. Since that takes more time to create and test than players take to exhaust it, naturally the next progression is to consider a troupe of dedicated actors and strategists to do these events on the fly, without need for developer support. There are many problems inherent with this setup as well, however. First, you need to make certain you have the right people. The individuals need to be fast and efficient typists with a near-encyclopedic knowledge of game lore. They also must be trustworthy enough to be given tools that could cause any number of cancellations if abused to the fullest. Once you start hiring these folks, keep going -- you'll need enough to effectively man over 100 realms. And that's only in the North American offices -- the international teams would naturally need their own dedicated crew.
  
  The number of realms is a clear detriment to this style of event. Now let's say you want to run a dynamic event. Ideally, you want the event to occur at the same time. Internationally. Staggering times is an alternative, but unfortunately brings with it spoilers and potential technical problems that will affect everyone on the realm regardless of whether or not they're participating (I'll get into this later). So it's a simultaneous event. You therefore need at least one person per realm if it's a simple event -- that's 100 employees dedicated to this alone. If it's an extremely simple event you may be able to pull it off by two-boxing, but 50 is still not an insignificant number.
  
  The problem is that the overall effect on the game is very small in the long run; most people probably won't even know the event occurred, regardless of what sort of in-game or out-of-game messaging used prior (to a point -- again, I'll cover this later). The cost, ergo, to maintain such a force of actors is not worth it. GMs couldn't do it -- they need to be focused on supporting players in-game. There is never a slow time for them.
  
  Ahhh, but volunteers could do it, you think. This comes with its own serious issues as well. Volunteers are long-distance and extremely hard to manage -- coordinating one hundred of them to execute an event is nigh-impossible. Inevitably something comes up. Also, maintaining the quality of the event is much more difficult when you cannot manage them as intricately. (I wish I could share the stories. :P ) Lastly, giving that kind of power to someone with very little accountability in the long run is a truly dangerous risk. And overall, again, this sort of thing does not have much impact unless you have a large amount of actors working the realms often; and that sort of system simply isn't financially feasible.
  
  On a side note, I know many people have brought up the "you are swimming in money, finances are no excuse" line, but you're not considering what I'm saying on the whole, specifically in terms of business. In any business, it's important to get a decent return from the money you invest in something. The sheer amount of funds requires to do true dynamic events would not return the investment well in the slightest. The overall impact on the game would still be relatively small, and then the company is out cash they could have been using to pay some more content developers. (If I spend money on a musical ice-maker, it might make the act of making ice more pleasant, but considering the overall impact it has on my experience as a whole, it really isn't worth the monetary investment.)
  
  
• Latency and Crowds; the Technical Factor. Another serious consideration, not to be overlooked, is the technical limitation of the server infrastructure. Huge crowds in a small area can cause problems. Huge crowds actively doing something in a small area is liable to cause something that leads to a realm restart. (Anyone who has participated in an Ironforge raid will be well aware of this.) Therefore, when considering world events, it is important that no event cause people to gather in such a way that would compromise playability from a technical standpoint. While not really a consideration anyone wants to make, it's nonetheless necessary that players not be drawn to one particular point.
  
  This is also why simultaneous events are important. If they're staggered, word-of-mouth travels quickly. More and more people end up waiting for the event in that area when it happens, thus leading to the technical issues.

---

Q u o t e:
Well I suggest YOU take YOUR head out of YOUR ass and realize what the people really want. Don't tell us something is not possible because your fat ass is too lazy and too incompetent to do it.

Eat $!@% Caydiem

---

---

Q u o t e:
What about hiring volunteer player staff to run extra events? Sony did for Everquest and they did a good job with it.

---

---

Q u o t e:
I just don't believe that it would be that hard for a GM to once a week take on the role of a "boss" or a faction leader and bring some spice to an unsuspecting town or capital. If they can't do it, let a high warlord or grandmarshal do it. Or use a volunteer "MVP" to do it for free.

Even I staged a "server event" on my server once by holding a tournament for a large collection of arcanite bars. All I am is a crappy hunter and we had a very good turnout. It was a bumpy ride but in the end it was good fun and is still remembered by some on my server.

I don't buy the Blizz party line on this one.

$300,000,000 in sales and fees for this response: "We can't stage live world events because its too hard" :P

Caydiem, I just don't believe your are being honest.

---

---

Q u o t e:
Your article only says why it isn't feasible not that it isn't possible. I am still waiting for you to explain how it isn't possible. Because, unlike the article, you repeatedly say it is impossible. If given the opportunity to explain to you, without getting banned, I would. I could even post pictures.

I understand with a large population it is not a good way to spend GMs and development time, but there is a difference between impossible and feasible.

Let me reiterate. Doing a scripted world event is possible.

---

---

Q u o t e:
By scripted I mean not manually. Not typing the text the NPC will say, not manually respawning NPCs, and not guiding the NPCs where to go and who to attack.

Quoting you:



You replied to me saying a non manual scripted event is not possible.

About the hostile thing, I don't mean to appear that way, sorry if it reads like that. Guess I should put smiley faces at the end?

---

---

Q u o t e:
Caydiem, something I am sure EVERYONE could agree on is that they would prefer you do 1 world event at different times for different servers. You dont need to have 100 people on all servers at once all working on a single event.

Here is what you could do. Take one GM, you already have this guy hired no problem there. Have him pick a random server one day. Give him control of the king of ironforge, Have him /yell in ironforge something about attacking orgrimmar. He can then open a gate to orgrimmar that all alliance players can take for the next little while. He stays in control of that character and with the alliance who have helped you have a simple quick and fun world event.

A few days later this very same person chooses a different server and does a different event. Maybe this time zuljin decides the trolls want to take over stormwind, bam 2 servers and hundreds of players just had a blast. Few days later this same guy takes control of a dreadlord and attacks ironforge.

another server a huge troll sets up and guards a bridge somewhere.

You have ONE single person doing events on all servers at different times the server events are different so there is no "spoilers" it is easy, it is fun, and it works. I have done this myself so I know companies can and do use this method.

---

---

Q u o t e:
Which I assume is having no idea about the feasiblity, which brings us back to the huge cash cow of WoW and uncertainty of return.

What is needed is a way to divert the risk of this type of issue away from current profitability.

But my point, lets just get this straight, no one has any idea about the financial feasibility and nothing has been done like this ever. Clearly room for opportunity as many companies are trying to emulate everything WoW does now.

---

---

Q u o t e:
Caydiem,

Here's the issue straight and simple.

Th community wants world altering events, adding another dungeon etc... isn't what we want.

I don't think you where hired to tell us what we want, you were hired to tell blizzard what we want. Shove the exscuses and go do your job.

---

[ post edited by Caydiem ]

---

Q u o t e:
by world events the community is speaking more about storyline sequences...not a fishing tournament or a carnival.

A world event where arthas just spawns in random areas and slays everything in his way. World Events where Thrall and the other leaders of major factions well lead raids against an opposing faction.

Real events that show the warcraft story and the war between the horde and alliance.

---

---

Q u o t e:
That argument makes no sense. Do you stand around in each zone and respawn every mob killed? No you add the amount that the NPC can move and the timer he can respawn on.

If the developers want this mob dead after, say ten kills, they can easily script that it. It has nothing to do with the number of servers it has to do with the developer's laziness.

---

• Developer Time vs. Player Time; the Repeatable Content Factor. Any sort of event like this takes time to create and execute. No company has infinite resources, and it's important that the talented staff work on projects that will make best use of their time. When working on a persistent world such as World of Warcraft, where no one actually finishes the game, repeatable content is a must. Players, by nature, devour content far faster than it can be implemented. Therefore, repeatable content is key. Dungeons are an example of this. Battlegrounds are another. They're features that are used by players over and over again.
  
  Now, world-changing events tend to be one-time happenings that may take a month to create but only two days to occur for players. The question comes into play... which is better? A one-time event with all the bells and whistles, or a new dungeon? Which would best utilize the developers' time? The answer, more often than not, turns out to be the one that pertains to repeatable content.
  
  
• Dynamic vs. Scripted; the Manpower Factor. The question then comes into play... all right, if you'd rather have the developers work on repeatable content, why not hire people specifically for world events? As someone who has done precisely that job for two other games in this genre, again, I'm fairly knowledgeable regarding the pros and cons.
  
  Let me define a term before I delve deeper: "dynamic event", in this case, is a term for a world event run and executed by actors in the world playing the NPCs or controlling the monsters in some fashion.
  
  Now, developers implementing world events are more akin to actual, coded game interactions -- true NPCs and scripted occurrences patched in. Since that takes more time to create and test than players take to exhaust it, naturally the next progression is to consider a troupe of dedicated actors and strategists to do these events on the fly, without need for developer support. There are many problems inherent with this setup as well, however. First, you need to make certain you have the right people. The individuals need to be fast and efficient typists with a near-encyclopedic knowledge of game lore. They also must be trustworthy enough to be given tools that could cause any number of cancellations if abused to the fullest. Once you start hiring these folks, keep going -- you'll need enough to effectively man over 100 realms. And that's only in the North American offices -- the international teams would naturally need their own dedicated crew.
  
  The number of realms is a clear detriment to this style of event. Now let's say you want to run a dynamic event. Ideally, you want the event to occur at the same time. Internationally. Staggering times is an alternative, but unfortunately brings with it spoilers and potential technical problems that will affect everyone on the realm regardless of whether or not they're participating (I'll get into this later). So it's a simultaneous event. You therefore need at least one person per realm if it's a simple event -- that's 100 employees dedicated to this alone. If it's an extremely simple event you may be able to pull it off by two-boxing, but 50 is still not an insignificant number.
  
  The problem is that the overall effect on the game is very small in the long run; most people probably won't even know the event occurred, regardless of what sort of in-game or out-of-game messaging used prior (to a point -- again, I'll cover this later). The cost, ergo, to maintain such a force of actors is not worth it. GMs couldn't do it -- they need to be focused on supporting players in-game. There is never a slow time for them.
  
  Ahhh, but volunteers could do it, you think. This comes with its own serious issues as well. Volunteers are long-distance and extremely hard to manage -- coordinating one hundred of them to execute an event is nigh-impossible. Inevitably something comes up. Also, maintaining the quality of the event is much more difficult when you cannot manage them as intricately. (I wish I could share the stories. :P ) Lastly, giving that kind of power to someone with very little accountability in the long run is a truly dangerous risk. And overall, again, this sort of thing does not have much impact unless you have a large amount of actors working the realms often; and that sort of system simply isn't financially feasible.
  
  On a side note, I know many people have brought up the "you are swimming in money, finances are no excuse" line, but you're not considering what I'm saying on the whole, specifically in terms of business. In any business, it's important to get a decent return from the money you invest in something. The sheer amount of funds requires to do true dynamic events would not return the investment well in the slightest. The overall impact on the game would still be relatively small, and then the company is out cash they could have been using to pay some more content developers. (If I spend money on a musical ice-maker, it might make the act of making ice more pleasant, but considering the overall impact it has on my experience as a whole, it really isn't worth the monetary investment.)
  
  
• Latency and Crowds; the Technical Factor. Another serious consideration, not to be overlooked, is the technical limitation of the server infrastructure. Huge crowds in a small area can cause problems. Huge crowds actively doing something in a small area is liable to cause something that leads to a realm restart. (Anyone who has participated in an Ironforge raid will be well aware of this.) Therefore, when considering world events, it is important that no event cause people to gather in such a way that would compromise playability from a technical standpoint. While not really a consideration anyone wants to make, it's nonetheless necessary that players not be drawn to one particular point.
  
  This is also why simultaneous events are important. If they're staggered, word-of-mouth travels quickly. More and more people end up waiting for the event in that area when it happens, thus leading to the technical issues.

---

Q u o t e:
Well I suggest YOU take YOUR head out of YOUR ass and realize what the people really want. Don't tell us something is not possible because your fat ass is too lazy and too incompetent to do it.

Eat $!@% Caydiem

---

---

Q u o t e:
What about hiring volunteer player staff to run extra events? Sony did for Everquest and they did a good job with it.

---

---

Q u o t e:
I just don't believe that it would be that hard for a GM to once a week take on the role of a "boss" or a faction leader and bring some spice to an unsuspecting town or capital. If they can't do it, let a high warlord or grandmarshal do it. Or use a volunteer "MVP" to do it for free.

Even I staged a "server event" on my server once by holding a tournament for a large collection of arcanite bars. All I am is a crappy hunter and we had a very good turnout. It was a bumpy ride but in the end it was good fun and is still remembered by some on my server.

I don't buy the Blizz party line on this one.

$300,000,000 in sales and fees for this response: "We can't stage live world events because its too hard" :P

Caydiem, I just don't believe your are being honest.

---

---

Q u o t e:
Your article only says why it isn't feasible not that it isn't possible. I am still waiting for you to explain how it isn't possible. Because, unlike the article, you repeatedly say it is impossible. If given the opportunity to explain to you, without getting banned, I would. I could even post pictures.

I understand with a large population it is not a good way to spend GMs and development time, but there is a difference between impossible and feasible.

Let me reiterate. Doing a scripted world event is possible.

---

---

Q u o t e:
By scripted I mean not manually. Not typing the text the NPC will say, not manually respawning NPCs, and not guiding the NPCs where to go and who to attack.

Quoting you:



You replied to me saying a non manual scripted event is not possible.

About the hostile thing, I don't mean to appear that way, sorry if it reads like that. Guess I should put smiley faces at the end?

---

---

Q u o t e:
Caydiem, something I am sure EVERYONE could agree on is that they would prefer you do 1 world event at different times for different servers. You dont need to have 100 people on all servers at once all working on a single event.

Here is what you could do. Take one GM, you already have this guy hired no problem there. Have him pick a random server one day. Give him control of the king of ironforge, Have him /yell in ironforge something about attacking orgrimmar. He can then open a gate to orgrimmar that all alliance players can take for the next little while. He stays in control of that character and with the alliance who have helped you have a simple quick and fun world event.

A few days later this very same person chooses a different server and does a different event. Maybe this time zuljin decides the trolls want to take over stormwind, bam 2 servers and hundreds of players just had a blast. Few days later this same guy takes control of a dreadlord and attacks ironforge.

another server a huge troll sets up and guards a bridge somewhere.

You have ONE single person doing events on all servers at different times the server events are different so there is no "spoilers" it is easy, it is fun, and it works. I have done this myself so I know companies can and do use this method.

---

---

Q u o t e:
Which I assume is having no idea about the feasiblity, which brings us back to the huge cash cow of WoW and uncertainty of return.

What is needed is a way to divert the risk of this type of issue away from current profitability.

But my point, lets just get this straight, no one has any idea about the financial feasibility and nothing has been done like this ever. Clearly room for opportunity as many companies are trying to emulate everything WoW does now.

---

---

Q u o t e:
Caydiem,

Here's the issue straight and simple.

Th community wants world altering events, adding another dungeon etc... isn't what we want.

I don't think you where hired to tell us what we want, you were hired to tell blizzard what we want. Shove the exscuses and go do your job.

---

• Developer Time vs. Player Time; the Repeatable Content Factor. Any sort of event like this takes time to create and execute. No company has infinite resources, and it's important that the talented staff work on projects that will make best use of their time. When working on a persistent world such as World of Warcraft, where no one actually finishes the game, repeatable content is a must. Players, by nature, devour content far faster than it can be implemented. Therefore, repeatable content is key. Dungeons are an example of this. Battlegrounds are another. They're features that are used by players over and over again.
  
  Now, world-changing events tend to be one-time happenings that may take a month to create but only two days to occur for players. The question comes into play... which is better? A one-time event with all the bells and whistles, or a new dungeon? Which would best utilize the developers' time? The answer, more often than not, turns out to be the one that pertains to repeatable content.
  
  
• Dynamic vs. Scripted; the Manpower Factor. The question then comes into play... all right, if you'd rather have the developers work on repeatable content, why not hire people specifically for world events? As someone who has done precisely that job for two other games in this genre, again, I'm fairly knowledgeable regarding the pros and cons.
  
  Let me define a term before I delve deeper: "dynamic event", in this case, is a term for a world event run and executed by actors in the world playing the NPCs or controlling the monsters in some fashion.
  
  Now, developers implementing world events are more akin to actual, coded game interactions -- true NPCs and scripted occurrences patched in. Since that takes more time to create and test than players take to exhaust it, naturally the next progression is to consider a troupe of dedicated actors and strategists to do these events on the fly, without need for developer support. There are many problems inherent with this setup as well, however. First, you need to make certain you have the right people. The individuals need to be fast and efficient typists with a near-encyclopedic knowledge of game lore. They also must be trustworthy enough to be given tools that could cause any number of cancellations if abused to the fullest. Once you start hiring these folks, keep going -- you'll need enough to effectively man over 100 realms. And that's only in the North American offices -- the international teams would naturally need their own dedicated crew.
  
  The number of realms is a clear detriment to this style of event. Now let's say you want to run a dynamic event. Ideally, you want the event to occur at the same time. Internationally. Staggering times is an alternative, but unfortunately brings with it spoilers and potential technical problems that will affect everyone on the realm regardless of whether or not they're participating (I'll get into this later). So it's a simultaneous event. You therefore need at least one person per realm if it's a simple event -- that's 100 employees dedicated to this alone. If it's an extremely simple event you may be able to pull it off by two-boxing, but 50 is still not an insignificant number.
  
  The problem is that the overall effect on the game is very small in the long run; most people probably won't even know the event occurred, regardless of what sort of in-game or out-of-game messaging used prior (to a point -- again, I'll cover this later). The cost, ergo, to maintain such a force of actors is not worth it. GMs couldn't do it -- they need to be focused on supporting players in-game. There is never a slow time for them.
  
  Ahhh, but volunteers could do it, you think. This comes with its own serious issues as well. Volunteers are long-distance and extremely hard to manage -- coordinating one hundred of them to execute an event is nigh-impossible. Inevitably something comes up. Also, maintaining the quality of the event is much more difficult when you cannot manage them as intricately. (I wish I could share the stories. :P ) Lastly, giving that kind of power to someone with very little accountability in the long run is a truly dangerous risk. And overall, again, this sort of thing does not have much impact unless you have a large amount of actors working the realms often; and that sort of system simply isn't financially feasible.
  
  On a side note, I know many people have brought up the "you are swimming in money, finances are no excuse" line, but you're not considering what I'm saying on the whole, specifically in terms of business. In any business, it's important to get a decent return from the money you invest in something. The sheer amount of funds requires to do true dynamic events would not return the investment well in the slightest. The overall impact on the game would still be relatively small, and then the company is out cash they could have been using to pay some more content developers. (If I spend money on a musical ice-maker, it might make the act of making ice more pleasant, but considering the overall impact it has on my experience as a whole, it really isn't worth the monetary investment.)
  
  
• Latency and Crowds; the Technical Factor. Another serious consideration, not to be overlooked, is the technical limitation of the server infrastructure. Huge crowds in a small area can cause problems. Huge crowds actively doing something in a small area is liable to cause something that leads to a realm restart. (Anyone who has participated in an Ironforge raid will be well aware of this.) Therefore, when considering world events, it is important that no event cause people to gather in such a way that would compromise playability from a technical standpoint. While not really a consideration anyone wants to make, it's nonetheless necessary that players not be drawn to one particular point.
  
  This is also why simultaneous events are important. If they're staggered, word-of-mouth travels quickly. More and more people end up waiting for the event in that area when it happens, thus leading to the technical issues.

---

Q u o t e:
Well I suggest YOU take YOUR head out of YOUR ass and realize what the people really want. Don't tell us something is not possible because your fat ass is too lazy and too incompetent to do it.

Eat $!@% Caydiem

---

---

Q u o t e:
What about hiring volunteer player staff to run extra events? Sony did for Everquest and they did a good job with it.

---

---

Q u o t e:
I just don't believe that it would be that hard for a GM to once a week take on the role of a "boss" or a faction leader and bring some spice to an unsuspecting town or capital. If they can't do it, let a high warlord or grandmarshal do it. Or use a volunteer "MVP" to do it for free.

Even I staged a "server event" on my server once by holding a tournament for a large collection of arcanite bars. All I am is a crappy hunter and we had a very good turnout. It was a bumpy ride but in the end it was good fun and is still remembered by some on my server.

I don't buy the Blizz party line on this one.

$300,000,000 in sales and fees for this response: "We can't stage live world events because its too hard" :P

Caydiem, I just don't believe your are being honest.

---

---

Q u o t e:
Your article only says why it isn't feasible not that it isn't possible. I am still waiting for you to explain how it isn't possible. Because, unlike the article, you repeatedly say it is impossible. If given the opportunity to explain to you, without getting banned, I would. I could even post pictures.

I understand with a large population it is not a good way to spend GMs and development time, but there is a difference between impossible and feasible.

Let me reiterate. Doing a scripted world event is possible.

---

---

Q u o t e:
By scripted I mean not manually. Not typing the text the NPC will say, not manually respawning NPCs, and not guiding the NPCs where to go and who to attack.

Quoting you:



You replied to me saying a non manual scripted event is not possible.

About the hostile thing, I don't mean to appear that way, sorry if it reads like that. Guess I should put smiley faces at the end?

---

---

Q u o t e:
Caydiem, something I am sure EVERYONE could agree on is that they would prefer you do 1 world event at different times for different servers. You dont need to have 100 people on all servers at once all working on a single event.

Here is what you could do. Take one GM, you already have this guy hired no problem there. Have him pick a random server one day. Give him control of the king of ironforge, Have him /yell in ironforge something about attacking orgrimmar. He can then open a gate to orgrimmar that all alliance players can take for the next little while. He stays in control of that character and with the alliance who have helped you have a simple quick and fun world event.

A few days later this very same person chooses a different server and does a different event. Maybe this time zuljin decides the trolls want to take over stormwind, bam 2 servers and hundreds of players just had a blast. Few days later this same guy takes control of a dreadlord and attacks ironforge.

another server a huge troll sets up and guards a bridge somewhere.

You have ONE single person doing events on all servers at different times the server events are different so there is no "spoilers" it is easy, it is fun, and it works. I have done this myself so I know companies can and do use this method.

---

---

Q u o t e:
Which I assume is having no idea about the feasiblity, which brings us back to the huge cash cow of WoW and uncertainty of return.

What is needed is a way to divert the risk of this type of issue away from current profitability.

But my point, lets just get this straight, no one has any idea about the financial feasibility and nothing has been done like this ever. Clearly room for opportunity as many companies are trying to emulate everything WoW does now.

---

---

Q u o t e:
Caydiem,

Here's the issue straight and simple.

Th community wants world altering events, adding another dungeon etc... isn't what we want.

I don't think you where hired to tell us what we want, you were hired to tell blizzard what we want. Shove the exscuses and go do your job.

---