Poster: Ikkin at 7/28/2005 8:12:57 AM PDT
Subject: BLUE: Why is Blizzard STILL silent about PVP? |
| |
Why is blizzard turning a blind eye to the issues with the current form of the honor system?
There have been numerous threads over the last few weeks about the state of the Honor System in World of Warcraft. I don't want to cross-link threads, but theres a very popular 17 page thread about people who have been stuck at lower ranks because the honor bonus from AV just doesn't compare with Warsong Gultch, since Warsong Gultch takes much less time to complete than an Alterac Valley.
There have been numerous threads about classes being ranked together, as if classes are made equal. These threads have shown great support for a system where each class competes on its OWN ranking, so priests compete with priests, paladins with paladins, and so on. Not every class is created equal, yet you rank them as if they are. Of course the obvious solution is group up, but battlegrounds isn't forced grouping, and not everyone is a team player.
The bottom line is- Why is blizzard turning a blind eye to the issues with the current form of the honor system?
Is it fair that a 10 minute WSG yields 3k honor, yet a 5 hour AV yields only 10k honor? Why not boost the Honor given in AV so you see more population in AV? Why not FORCE everyone into a raid so everyone shares the honor from kills?
Is it fair that ranged classes can earn far more honor-per-target than melee classes? Why not make each class be on its own ranking system, so paladins & rogues and what have you need not compete with mages & what have you? Are you THAT worried about people gaining rank?
Is Warsong gulch the ONLY way you expect us to get rank 14?
Why is blizzard turning a blind eye to the issues with the current form of the honor system?
| | | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-general&t=4226568&p=#post4226568 | | | Poster: Kalgan at 7/28/2005 10:32:34 AM PDT
Subject: Re: BLUE: Why is Blizzard STILL silent about PVP? |
| |
Q u o t e:
Why is blizzard turning a blind eye to the issues with the current form of the honor system?
There have been numerous threads over the last few weeks about the state of the Honor System in World of Warcraft. I don't want to cross-link threads, but theres a very popular 17 page thread about people who have been stuck at lower ranks because the honor bonus from AV just doesn't compare with Warsong Gultch, since Warsong Gultch takes much less time to complete than an Alterac Valley.
There have been numerous threads about classes being ranked together, as if classes are made equal. These threads have shown great support for a system where each class competes on its OWN ranking, so priests compete with priests, paladins with paladins, and so on. Not every class is created equal, yet you rank them as if they are. Of course the obvious solution is group up, but battlegrounds isn't forced grouping, and not everyone is a team player.
The bottom line is- Why is blizzard turning a blind eye to the issues with the current form of the honor system?
Is it fair that a 10 minute WSG yields 3k honor, yet a 5 hour AV yields only 10k honor? Why not boost the Honor given in AV so you see more population in AV? Why not FORCE everyone into a raid so everyone shares the honor from kills?
Is it fair that ranged classes can earn far more honor-per-target than melee classes? Why not make each class be on its own ranking system, so paladins & rogues and what have you need not compete with mages & what have you? Are you THAT worried about people gaining rank?
Is Warsong gulch the ONLY way you expect us to get rank 14?
Why is blizzard turning a blind eye to the issues with the current form of the honor system?
I agree that before patch 6 there was a discrepancy, but since the changes in patch 6 to NPC training coupled with some of the mechanics being tuned to be more offensive (such as ordering gryphon/wyvern attacks on the enemy base) the trend seems to be changing in the other direction on PvP servers (which will probably catch on on PvE servers after a while).
On several high-population PvP servers, we're seeing as many as 5 simultaneous Alterac Valley instances (significantly more players than are in Warsong Gulch), with many of the Alterac Valley instances being won within an hour (sometimes as quickly as 25 minutes). So, in summary I would say that the core issue was in how long Alterac Valley battles were taking to resolve, and not in the bonus honor values.[ post edited by Kalgan ]
| | | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-general&t=4226568&p=#post4228784 | Poster: Kalgan at 7/28/2005 10:46:51 AM PDT
Subject: Re: BLUE: Why is Blizzard STILL silent about PVP? |
| |
Q u o t e:
thank you for ignoring the fact that bonus honor far outweighs HK honor, so what class you are is altogether irrelevant to the system.
There is some measure of truth to this statement. Bonus honor makes up a significant portion of your total honor gain, which places a great significant on team success versus class dps differences. In addition, the tendency is for players to group in battlegrounds, allowing players who are playing supporting roles to share in the honor gains from killing.
That being said, Paladins in particular are receiving a new spell in patch 7 that should help their damage contribution in a standoff fight like Alterac Valley, or in a scenario where they normally couldn't quite finish their opponent.
| | | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-general&t=4226568&p=#post4229012 | Poster: Kalgan at 7/28/2005 11:12:46 AM PDT
Subject: Re: BLUE: Why is Blizzard STILL silent about PVP? |
| |
Q u o t e:
That's why the top 3 DPS classes in the game were the top 3 winners in the honor contest? Pure coincidence, huh?
If you look at the honor results, you'll see a direct correlation in class wins to DPS. The less DPS, the less wins.
FYI: The honor contest started and ended before battlegrounds existed.
| | | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-general&t=4226568&p=#post4229508 | Poster: Kalgan at 7/28/2005 11:44:49 AM PDT
Subject: Re: BLUE: Why is Blizzard STILL silent about |
| |
Q u o t e:
True, Kalgan, but melee classes STILL spend more time dead than alive. A good warrior utilizes charge/fear/snare to help his mages pick off the main lines, and then dies.
If group honor was given regardless of alive/dead and regardless of location, those melee classes would actually benefit from helping the team by suiciding. Theres nothing more frustrating for a warrior than the run-back, and examining the scoreboards to see a mage who has died 0 or 1 times, all the while getting full honor at the front lines.
If faction turn-ins & honor kills were made this way, group only, this would eliminate:
1) leeching of faction turn ins, people could boot afk'ers from the group
2) Honor kill ratio for ranged classes vs. melee classes
Ikkin, I don't think a good melee'er necessarily spends more time dead than alive. Refer to this thread to see some screenshots of Alterac Valley scoreboards...
http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-realm-tichondrius&t=138593&p=1&tmp=1#post138593
I happen to know that "Mass" is a warrior (note his 53 killing blows, 12 deaths) as is "Lunge" (in a screenshot farther down in the thread posted by "Gezus") with 116 KBs to 49 deaths ratio. It's not unusual that I see rogues and warriors very high on the charts in AV with very impressive kill:death ratios (and the rogues certainly don't tend to have dedicated healers). This isn't to say that "all things are equal" in all battlegrounds, but I do want to point out that these claims are generally exaggerated, and that we often see examples that directly contradict claims that melee classes have no chance to be successful in Alterac Valley.
| | | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-general&t=4226568&p=#post4230140 |
View all recent official Blue Posts
|
